| Author | Message | ||
     Budgolf |
Picked up a Dyna shift minder and a pingel kill switch with light bracket off of ebay for 105 bucks. not bad for 300 dollars worth of parts. Anyone know how to hook this stuff up?! | ||
| Williep13 |
Is the pingel kill switch electric or air? If air do you have the cylinder or just the switch? The shift minder is easy I will send you a schematic. Do you have a light? | ||
| Hybridmomentspass |
THat does seem like a good deal. I know pingel sells the kills for about 80 bucks new (from them or PR Factory). Willie - I think hes talking about the actual tethered kill, not the kill for the shifter. Bud - right now there is a guy local (to me, he's in high point) with a MRE shifter for 100 bucks. Its on CL. Dont know if it'd interest you or not, just passing info along. | ||
| Puzzled |
Nice f'ing score! Budgolf I also have the wiring diagrams here for the shift minder. You can use that to operate your shift light and air shifter. | ||
| Budgolf |
Thanks Mike. I'll take you up on that. | ||
| Williep13 |
I wouldn't use the shift minder to operate the airshifter! It can be consist and like having an automatic transmission (taking all the fun out of it) but most the time it causes more problems wiring your air shifter to activate using the shift minder. I learned the hard way and so have several others. If you don't want to take my word for it start a post on the AHDRA site on any other drag racing only site and I think the census would concur. | ||
| Puzzled |
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| Puzzled |
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| Fast1075 |
That circuit needs a latch timer to keep the solenoid powered and a totalizing delay to prevent spurious signals from incorrect activation....the best auto shifters have a delay timer that prevents the 1-2 shift for 1/2 second and the totalizing timer counts at switchpoint rpm (if it is set to shift at 7k for example, it must be at 7k continuously fo "x" time before the shift occurs) so it will not shift prematurely if the tire spins a bit. Hope all your competition uses a shift minder alone...they will hand you free rounds AND break parts. In short, listen to Williep. | ||
| Puzzled |
What is a latch timer? Yes my bike will shift to 2nd if I spin the tire. Not necessarily always a bad thing.  I don't see how the shift minder will break parts or tears up on anything. Help me out here what am I missing? The Pingel is doing the shifting, the Shift minder is sending the signal to a relay to activate the Pingel the same as a button would. | ||
| Budgolf |
Thanks for the diagrams Mike. Going to come in handy. | ||
| Hybridmomentspass |
Fast - I, too, am curious about the breaking parts thing. Im not running that setup (just using the DSM to tell me when to shift, using Air/Air pingel), but Im curious what you meant by it. As he also stated - Willie is smart, take advice from him. | ||
| Hybridmomentspass |
ps - Puzzled - great posts! | ||
| Fast1075 |
Electrical stuff activates in milliseconds if the tire spins and hooks it can happen so fast that the shift actuated by the rpm increase is incomplete...it is the same as "missing" a shift...if the gear dogs are not fully engaged, you can kill gears and shift forks....never mind throwing away the round In a perfect world it will work, I have tried it...it usually worked, but always seemed to not work when I needed it most...late in the evening when the traction was low, or mid day when the track temp was high and slick..if the bike has enough power to spin the tire down track, the shift minder is not a good idea at all. It is true that I am a "retired" racer and I ran import bikes, but there is no difference in what size, kind, or type of bike you are racing. The dynamics are the same.....without the timers it will not work reliably...I saw one case (the guy brought me the engine to fix) where the bike went less than the 60ft and locked up the trans...when I took it apart, it was in 4th gear...it had spun, shifted 3 times and broke a fork in maybe 40-50 feet...guy said it locked up before he could get his feet on the pegs. | ||
| Puzzled |
It is true that I am a "retired" racer and I ran import bikes ...and we want every bit of knowledge left in the that old head! As I said to you in Daytona the few key pointers you gave me with setting up my bars made a big difference. Some of this information just isn't printed on the net. First hand knowledge rules. Explain the alternative methods of getting a "tried and true" way of getting an electronic RPM activated shift. As for the relay I use now, I have been fortunate in it has worked for me. Than again I run a Buell down on power! } | ||
| Williep13 |
The shift minder doesn't break parts, but the shift minder wired to "auto" shift does, In my opinion. I speak only form experience, you can go back and look at the post on here from me over the last 2-3 years and on the AHDRA site where I had problems with shifting and it all came down to it being wired to "auto" shift configuration. It is great in theory and does work most of the time but when it doesn't like FAST1075 was saying it is bad really bad. I never tried the latch timer got tired of rebuilding transmissions and no one gave me that advice till later. The only thing that was ever pointed out to me was make sure your engine kill time is the proper duration so while I was messing with that the shift minder was double shifting and my tranny was taking a beating. To make a longer story short I highly recommend not using the shift minder to auto shift and then taking the Pingel air engine kill selling it on ebay and buying an electric engine kill I am a fan of the Dyna shift counter but Pingle makes a good product as well. Hybrid- Thanks for the compliment but I'm not smart just messed up a lot stuff and it cost a lot of $$$ so I try to help out any one I see heading down that same road. | ||
| Bott |
I tried to run an air-kill last season, to replace a Pingel electronic that had died. I was not able to get consistency , so I wrapped up the season foot shifting. Needless to say, the T-Kill is off, and I picked up an MPS killbox over winter. Also have changed to CO2. Untested yet on the strip, but with fewer fittings and a simpler setup I'm confident with this setup | ||
| Fast1075 |
Air kill is reliable, but very very fussy with initial setup....the air line to the kill switch must be a specific lenght determined by the lenght of the line to the cylinder as measured from the tee...get it wrong and the kill interval either starts too early or too late. The kill duration is determined by the size of the bleed hole in the piston..feed it clean, dry gas and on occasion lube it internally....the only part to wear out is the microswitch....and I shook a pile of them apart over the years...until I went to an integrated controller... | ||
| Hybridmomentspass |
Fast - what do you internally lube it with, and how? | ||
| Budgolf |
You guys running air, do you have to run an on board compressor or can you fill it like a tire? | ||
| Bott |
you can fill the bottle with any compressor, but you will need to fill it prior to each pass, thats why a lot of people run the onboard | ||
| Budgolf |
Awesome. I'm sure I'll end up going with an onboard and an electronic kill soon, but I'm deploying again in a couple of months so I'm not going too crazy right now. here's the shifter kit I just ordered. http://www.rcsperformanceonline.com/T_Kill_Air_Shi fter_Kits_p/air%20shifter%20t%20kill%20kit.htm Guess I should have ordered some bottle brackets huh. | ||
| Hybridmomentspass |
Yeah, you can fill it like a tire, its easy. BUT Its much easier to have an onboard compressor. Its really nice for TNT nights when youre doing a few hot laps in a row or running two classes back to back on same bike - Leave the timing booth, flip a switch and ride back ot the staging lanes and its good to go. I have a Pingel, but I know Willie was telling me that he (and I've heard of others doing it too) used an inexpensive compressor from auto zone/advance and made it work. I got to be honest - the Pingel unit is pricey (think I paid 60 bucks?), but they do work great. My first lasted 4 years before wearing out | ||
| Hybridmomentspass |
You posted while I was typing - Im using worm gears to secure my bottle to my frame. I know we're dealing with two completely different bikes, but just saying, it might work. Luckily there are some others with 1125s that have went down this road before (puzzled, i think?), so you can get great advice on that sort of thing from them | ||
| Bott |
I dont have a closer pic, but basically it is just a piece of aluminum flatstock, about 8 inches long bolted through the side of the undertail. Then 2 worm gear clamps, as hybrid said. Bottle brackets are too expensive lol  | ||
| Hybridmomentspass |
Bott - cool idea. You, or someone, could even use the passenger holes to mount the bar. Then no additional drilling required, just a thought. | ||
| Budgolf |
Awesome. Thanks for all of the great ideas guys. | ||
| Fast1075 |
I used silicone fishing reel grease (about the same consistency as vasoline), take the valve apart and lube the moving parts lightly...something I picked up playing with air rifles. On a similar topic, adjusting the kill time...go to the welding supply store and get a set of tip cleaner drill bits..enlargening the bleed hole in the piston shortens the kill duration...if you go too big, use some good solder (radio shack has some very good solder) to close the hole and start over. If the kill duration (applies to any kind of kill device) is too short you may get incomplete shifts and if the transmission is not backcut (a good idea anyway) you get faster gear dog wear...if the kill is too long, you waste ET and the unloading does whacky things with the chassis...not so much a problem with lower horsepower combos, but when you get in the 200 hp+ range, it makes a huge difference...then you are in territory where you need 1-2 or 1-2-3 auto setups to keep from unloading the chassis...not a problem with weekend warrior ET stuff generally...but most racers "evolve" faster and faster...that is really what finally made me call it quits...it simply got too expensive and too time consuming to keep the bikes in top condition. | ||
| Puzzled |
but most racers "evolve" faster and faster...that is really what finally made me call it quits...it simply got too expensive and too time consuming to keep the bikes in top condition. Once my combo is all sorted out I have a plane ticket and hotel reservations here with your name on it!} | ||
| Puzzled |
I have to compare wiring diagrams but it occured to me that the Dyna instruction have their own version of "Auto" shift. I wonder how that compares to the hand drawn version I posted. I say this as Pingel supplied me with the hand drawn version as opposed to using the Dyna instructions, hmmm. I'll place them side by side when I get in the office. |
