| Author | Message | ||
     Slaughter |
Going to be putting the new Slipper on the XB racebike - since this is now a part available to riders WITHOUT a racing license, would there be any interest in a photo-story? Aint gonna be no winnin racin kinda thing - just some tech stuff with pictures. Here? XB section? | ||
| Rocketsprink |
i'd be more than interested as it is one of my planned upgrades for next season. | ||
| Slaughter |
Yeah, I never really thought I'd do it but a few times now doing some hard braking and especially trying to pass under braking, I've had bad enough puckering that I just decided this is something I just had to do. Started soaking the plates today. MIGHT start the work next Wed... if we don't travel out of town over the Holiday (dang but the personal and family stuff keeps interfering with the really COOL stuff) | ||
| Gentleman_jon |
love to see the photos. There are a lot more visitors to the XB board, even though most don't race. | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
Post it here. I think its more "likely" that a racer will "need" a slipper clutch than a street rider and more probable that a racer would go down because of a RW lock up. Just post a link to this thread and the street riders can discuss it over there, if they wish. I'd be interested in all of it (including the price). I've locked up the rear on the Blast (formerly known as Buell) on the track and I'd be interested on how well it would work on the P3 since you're really trying to wring everything out of it you can (well, at least James is). Finally we have somewhat of a class to run (with contingency!), but money is now tight  | ||
| Slaughter |
What is the contingency from Antelope Valley for the 500 singles? (guessing probably something like $2500 per year for the ENTIRE field) I realize the slipper probably goes right onto the Blast (formerly known as Buell) (by the way Eric, My hybrid will FINALLY be tested this year - racing in 2010) | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
2010 would be awesome since most of the class now qualifies for Formula singles you'll fit right in and it should be some good racing  Ernie will be happy too. Contingency is between $1500 & $2500, I couldnt find it on the website and I think James got $60 for 2nd place. | ||
| Slaughter |
Yeah - Ernie has been ON MY BUTT about the XBBlast for about 3 years now every since I put the rolling chassis together. | ||
| Trojan |
Slaughter. Is the Buell slipper clutch the one made by STM? What is the price of as I can't find it on the Buell site (or is it only available from Henry?). | ||
| Buellrcr |
stm clutch is 1200 bucks, and clutch plates are about 110 bucks, and the main and the secondary spring ,my have to be replaced for size and your weight. makes a big differents on the motor not as hard on the crank. and settles the bike down before entering a corner, no rear wheel hop | ||
| Slaughter |
I have to look at the P&A catalogue link on Buell.com They have a new catalogue posted. I just got the beast and JUST received two sets of plates from Henry. This is the STM unit | ||
| Slaughter |
Catalogue is still online an the STM slipper is listed (as is the racing slipper for the 1125r) BUELL P&A Catalogue - PDF (It's a big download) - page 9 NOTE: requires Redline ATF (or equivalent) - I have some Torco ATF - but with all the Redline ATF varieties listed, I've asked just WHICH is the recommended ATF. Have the plates soaking now for a week | ||
| Rocketsprink |
http://www.oncycles.com/catalog.asp?r=1&pn=DTP0002 5 | ||
| Buellrcr |
i am using forumla plus harley oil , i have used and change oil after every race weekend and have not had any problems, and clutches have been in the bike for 11 race weekends. just my 2 cents | ||
| Buellrcr |
and running alto clutch plates | ||
| Slaughter |
You got 11 races on one set of clutch plates? I got two sets - the Alto carbon plates. Good to know (and I don't mind changing 1 quart of fluid each month - heck, nobody said racing was cheap!) | ||
| Diablobrian |
I'd be interested in seeing pics and getting your input on the install. | ||
| Buellrcr |
change the oil and adjust clutch ,after every race weekend | ||
| Slaughter |
Keith, I'm kinda/sorta excited about this "new toy." Did you notice any change in the slip with clutch wear? I didn't get any adjustment instructions or "hints" with the clutch (emailed STM to ask) - assembly instructions - yes, adjustment/setup/tuning - no. | ||
| Walt221 |
Make sure you use just a dab of grease to hold the ball bearings and secondary spring in place. Otherwise they won't stay in during assembly. Use as little as possible though because if you use too much your clutch will feel like it's slipping your first ride. Also make sure that the inner spring guide is aligned on the three pins. If it slips off even a little bit, the nut will tighten down against the guide and not the inner hub (I usually put a little grease on the pins)....if the nut does tighten up wrong, you will not be happy with the result.... I was probably one of the first three to get a Buell STM slipper here in the states back in 2006 and I bet I've done the assembly at least 30 times since then. It's not bad once you've done it a few times. If your bike produces between 100 and 115 hp I would start with a 70 or 80 secondary spring and a 180 or 190 primary spring. It also works nice with the CRG GP clutch lever if you modify your clutch cable slightly. | ||
| Slaughter |
I'll go look at the springs - they were ordered based on "normal" HP for an XB-based racebike. Wish they had a bigger parking lot at Antelope Valley! Be kinda nice to test before the practice day but it LOOKS like it's simple enough once it all comes together. Grease on the ball/ramps is a GOOD suggestion!!! I can see that being a nightmare as you're building it up and one ball rolls away. | ||
| Slaughter |
Springs are 160 (primary) 40 (secondary) Bike is putting out just a wee tad over 100HP (depending on mood and which dyno and which elevation/location). | ||
| Blake |
I'm thinking that engine torque is more important relative to spring size than the HP. With your higher revving short stroker 1170 race engine, maybe the lighter springs will work fine. | ||
| Slaughter |
True dat ^ It is the back-torque when rolling off/downshifting with no weight on the rear. It'll be interesting. I pitted with a guy for a while who teaches for Fastrack Riders out here - Matthias Jezek. He had a Kawi 636 (upgrade from an R6) - he said it took a while to adjust his riding style and technique to be able to use it properly but once he got used to it, it WAS a perfect tool. (Message edited by slaughter on August 22, 2009) | ||
| Blake |
I've heard tell that people say the same about me. | ||
| Walt221 |
The primary spring is what gives you your holding power for engine hp/torque....160 is still pretty light for 100 hp....You could try it, but have extra plates and a spring ready just in case. The secondary spring is purely for how much engine braking you want. A 40kg spring will be like riding a 2 stroke with almost no engine breaking. I wouldn't recommend it, because the feel is pretty squirely, plus the extra slipping action is harder on the plates. These are purely my opinions based on running the STM in a XBRR and a Thunderbike. Good luck with whatever combo you end up with. | ||
| Slaughter |
Yeah - this combo is what I got when I picked up the spare slipper unused from Glendale. I'm going to hit up Henry and get a couple heavier springs shot out before I bolt it all shut. I have almost 4 weeks before next race at Willow. Thanks for the heads-up! | ||
| Rocketsprink |
Walt. do you still have that stm for sale, or did you sell it? | ||
| Maru |
I have a slipper in my Husky 450 SMR. Without it you have to be so careful downshfting while under heavy braking. With it you can get away with murder, amazing thing. | ||
| Slaughter |
Well... got the slipper installed. I thought I was going to get you all sorts of detailed pics but face it, my hands were totally covered with oil and ATF the whole time and it just became a real pain to keep wiping my hands, washing them, taking a pic, putting the camera in a safe place and continuing. Basically, the process was pretty straightforward. The instructions are kinda/sorta handy but you really suffer from the poor translation of Italian. They could have used a few assembly photographs - but if you look at the exploded drawing and the part numbers, it's not that bad a task. Instructions - this is ALL (click) First - bike up on the stand at Antelope Valley Buell (my home shop is too full of crap and besides, we keep the bike at Antelope Valley on display)  Sidecase cover off, old clutch ready for removal:  View of the ball-and-ramp slipper mechanism. Balls held in place with Redline assembly grease. When the housing is flipped over and placed against the balls/ramps - you can immediately see/feel how the thing should work - the ramps force the clutch stack apart with the back-torque:  Housing and back plate together - ball-and-ramp gizmo only partly visible through holes:  Housing in position, secondary (slipper) spring in place. Installation nut not threaded in place yet. The installation nut comes with the slipper kit. Original is not used:  At this point, I put the slipper in place, torqued down the nut and put the plates into the basket. My hands were drenched with synthetic ATF for the next hour and I gave up trying to get to the camera. Plates had been soaking a week, I was getting it everywhere. Logan and Steve at Antelope Valley were laughing at the mess I was making. Had to press the outer bearing out of the stock clutch hub to use in the slipper. It was then pressed into the red "spider" - and the pic is of the whole thing ready for being closed in by the side case:  After side case and adjustment-by-feel - ready to finish closing out, cleaning up and doing a parking lot test. Can't get out of first gear but was able to burn in the new clutch - it at least felt OK as far as a normal clutch should feel on starting out. Can't know how it'll feel as a slipper until Practice day in 3 weeks.  I used the 160 main spring, 40 secondary spring - Walt Sipp advised that they might be light so I ordered the next heavier set just in case. Next race weekend will be more testing than racing anyways (how's about that for a ready-excuse???) The cool thing is that the whole install can be done in your garage, no specialized tools (except I'd advise using an impact for removing the original) - with the wheel on the ground and the tranny in 1st gear, you CAN torque up the hub nut on final installation. I'll post up some impressions on using the slipper - when it gets to the track in 3 weeks. Kinda hard trying to get the feel of the slipper clutch in the parking lot of Antelope Valley Buell! (but on starting out, she felt "normal"... we'll see) (Message edited by slaughter on August 31, 2009) |
