| Author | Message | ||
     Xb984r |
"Given the success of the 1125R and CR, the bikes would likely sell out in short order even at a hefty price tag." I don't see a 1199cc Buell with a hefty price tag, selling out in short order. I wouldn't call selling bikes thousands under msrp a success.We will soon see though. | ||
| Diablo1 |
Let's test that theory with some simple mathematics. Your theory is that for the lack of 75cc compared to the twin cylinder limit of 1200cc of engine displacement, the 1125R engine is incapable of providing competitive performance at the WSBK level. Did I get that correct? What percentage are we talking about the 1125cc engine being down compared to 1200cc? 75/1200=6.25% Sorry, given that the bikes are putting down upwards of 200 RWHP, 12.5 HP give or take just won't make much difference at any but the fastest tracks and then with top speeds upwards of 200 mph, the difference in top speed is small. Blake...you're absolutely correct, how silly of me not to have realized that mathematically, Buell has already won the WSBK championship, without even entering a race. For those that live in the real world, talk is cheap, and your claims mean nada until the bike actually shows up on the WSBK grid. You can tell me I'm an ignorant fool on the day that Buell shows up in WSBK. Until then, I know who's talking out his exhaust pipe. } } | ||
| Blake |
"12.5Hp of difference can be the difference finishing between 1st and 15th at a good level of racing. I think this is the case with BMW at the 4 races so far in WSBK." That is not borne out by facts. Just ask Troy Baylis and Valentino Rossi. Heck ask any competent racer. Peak HP rarely wins races. Peak HP within a normal spread of contestants is not what allows one machine to out-perform its competition. Mladin and Spies Suzuki of past years and Spies R1 this year had/have no advantage in peak HP borne out by speed traps and other objective measures of the parameter. | ||
| Blake |
Diablow, Still waiting for just one ioda of fact from you to back up all your baloney naysaying. ... Still waiting. | ||
| Vagelis46 |
"Just ask Troy Baylis and Valentino Rossi." Exactly. Extra Hp was the reason Yamaha changed to pneumatic valves for the M1, and Ducati asked for 1200cc(1098R) instead of 1000cc(999R). If you are down on power you start a race with a very big disadvantage. | ||
| Jaimec |
Extra horsepower yes, but as for the M1 (at least), it is still far from being the fastest bike down the straight on the grid. I don't know enough about the big Duc to comment (didn't get interested in WSBK till this year... wonder why that is?). Still, I recall Troy Bayliss had no problems winning even with the "antique" 999R which had no displacement advantage over the competition. | ||
| Vagelis46 |
The conclusion from this discussion is that a well developed V-2 1200cc with a good rider is a competitive package in WSBK level against 1000cc 4cyl. Ducati has made this very clear. The next question is this : Can the chassis-brakes-suspension set up of the 1125R handle 180-200RWHP ?? This question will only be answered if a 1200cc Rotax is developed and used on the Buell. Until then I hope Danny Eslick make us all proud by continuing his great achievements. | ||
| Jaimec |
DAMN IT! Speed is doing it AGAIN! Race 1 on Sunday evening, Race 2 Tuesday AFTERNOON! Why do they do this?? I suppose it could be worse... they don't show the AMA races until two WEEKS after it already ended... | ||
| Gregtonn |
Just to add a little more spice to the pot. Has anyone considered that HD could have the MV Agusta F4 destroked to 1,000cc and go superbike racing in both the AMA and WSB? If there has been anything significant from MV Agusta since it was purchased by Harley is seems to be under the radar. Hmmm, I wonder if...? G | ||
| Jaimec |
Didn't MV Agusta used to field a team in both series? | ||
| Palerider |
Then don't watch it Sunday. Watch both race 1 & 2 on Tuesday, noon to 2pm eastern. Just stay away from here or any motorsports news. | ||
| Blake |
Vag, Troy Baylis is a heck of a lot more than merely "a good rider"; so is Max Biagi. They are great riders for sure. Given that clarification, you could just as easily have said that... The conclusion from this discussion is that a very highly developed V-2 1000cc with a great rider is a competitive package in WSBK level against 1000cc 4cyl. Ducati has made this very clear. | ||
| Jaimec |
PR: You ask the impossible! I might be able to sneak out of work for an hour to catch the race, but not both. But to not see the results for almost three days? I like inviting my friends over on Sundays for a Race Viewing Party. Better to be able to watch BOTH races (as we did last time) than just one. | ||
| Palerider |
I know what you mean J. I can't catch them during the week either unless I record them or I'm off work. I've been watching WSBK over the last few years and occasionally they have both races on the same day, sometimes separated by an hour or several hours. Even back to back if it is a special event. I think last years MMP was like that. Then sometimes, as this coming weekend, they'll show one race and then the next race and/or both, a couple days later. Not great for a long, race party but much better than the AMA/DMG Speed Channel broadcasts. Gotta watch 'em any way we can! | ||
| Blublak |
I'm confused.. What WSBK race are we talking about? I thought the next one isn't until April 5th.. There wasn't anything on this weekend (that I know of) except for the AMA day one at Fontana.. I think day two is next week? (this is such a mess..) But there was a WSBK race this weekend? | ||
| Jaimec |
We're talking about the upcoming race this weekend. | ||
| Vagelis46 |
Try www.worldsbk.com , the official site, to watch races live and free ! | ||
| Jaimec |
Vagelis, The videos on that website are blocked in the United States due to broadcasting contracts. Don't know how the MotoGP site can broadcast here and WSBK can't but that's the situation. | ||
| Greenlantern |
Try www.worldsbk.com , the official site, to watch races live and free ! Damn if that is not cool! Hope DMG and Speed are paying attention.  | ||
| Jaimec |
GL: US IP addresses are blocked on that site. You CAN'T see the races live on the web. | ||
| Vagelis46 |
No democracy in USA then ??? People cannot watch what they want. | ||
| Sd26 |
No democracy in USA then ??? People cannot watch what they want. Someone owns WSB rights. Actually, we have to honor contracts between men. Would one have it another way? | ||
| Greenlantern |
GL: US IP addresses are blocked on that site. You CAN'T see the races live on the web. The replays are cool enough, still better than what we have. (yeah yeah I know, contracts, rights, but hey, one can wish can't one?) | ||
| Jaimec |
Two "Murrican" former-Suzuki riders on the grid this weekend in Valencia! How cool is this? REAL racing, without stupid, arbitrary classifications muddying the waters. No idiotic "Safety Car," no rolling starts, the way it's SUPPOSED to be. GO BEN! GO HOPPER!! | ||
| Blake |
"without stupid, arbitrary classifications muddying the waters." You mean like... A two cylinder superbike gets 1200cc, but IL4 superbikes are limited to just 1000cc? I'm with you on the safety car and rolling starts... STUPID! I say... bring back the old style, run to the bike and start it, GP starts! | ||
| Oddball |
Yeah that would be interesting. A change from the norm and bringing back old tradition. ok that's a car but same thing. | ||
| Jaimec |
Blake; Before it was 1000/1200 it was 750/1000, remember? Then when the Ducatis started winning EVERYTHING it was changed to 1000s for all. I prefer the old MotoGP idea. Everyone runs the SAME displacement, but you have different weight allowances based on the number of cylinders in your engine. But even 1000/1200 makes a LOT more sense to me than 600/1125. The difference in displacement there is a helluva lot more than just 20% (or even the 25% in the old AMA formula). But I'll leave this argument to the AMA discussion threads; it doesn't have anything to do with WSBK. I'm hoping Hopper does good this weekend but I'm pretty certain Ben is going to do ANOTHER double in Valencia! GO ELBOWZ!!! | ||
| Vagelis46 |
MV Agusta is doing really well at World Superstock 1000cc. H-D should be happy. http://www.worldsbk.com/it/news/ultimi-risultati/3 50-superstock-1000-free-practice-2nd-session.html | ||
| Jaimec |
THREE SUPERPOLES IN A ROW FOR SPIES!!! Go Elbowz!!! | ||
| Vagelis46 |
This is going a very tough race Haga vs Spies. I also hope that Gugliano on the MV Agusta wins the superstock race. |
