| Author | Message | ||
     Buellfirebolt31 |
Can you please just list the things you need to do to START racing, and anything that is a must and a really needed to race. You don't need to specify unless you really want to, just list the things. Also, with a stock 06 XB12R with a Jardine and Race ECM and K&N, out the door how much would it be to start racing? Thanks for everything in advance. Brad | ||
| Slaughter |
Actually, it does depend on what your particular racing organization requires. The org's I'm aware of all publicize their rules on their websites. Some are really anal-retentive on safety-wiring and securing things - in fact, MOST Clubs require more than even the AMA does. Basically, there are some general rules: Remove mirrors and turn signals (most allow taping over the signals if you are so inclined - but the XB are so simple to remove that it's silly to leave them on the bike) Remove head and tail lights (again, most allow taping over the lights but I recommend removing - at least pull the fuses) Safety wire EVERY thing that holds back a fluid - oil or brake fluid. SOME race organizations allow using a "booger" of silicone instead of safety wire when you can't easily reach with safety wire (check your rules). Safety wire the oil filter to prevent its spinning loose. K&N makes a filter with drilled holes but you can use a hose clamp around the body and wire it to prevent it unscrewing AND wire it to the engine case. Every race organization I've heard about requires an oil-containing bellypan. Some race organizations require safety wire on the exhaust hangers (again, check with your organization) ALL systems must function well (brakes, suspension, steering) - tires must be danged near new when you go through tech. You will likely have to have EITHER a one piece set of leathers or a 2-piece with full circumference zipper (check your rules) - gauntlet type gloves covering past the wrist, full face DOT/SNELL helmet (check rules) - boots usually not allowed to have laces on the exterior (Alpinestars SMX use laces but are covered by a second zipped flap) If you are going to use the bike for racing only, you're probably going to want to permanently take off all the street stuff and ebay that stuff. All vents must go to a catch can - crankcase and tranny - OR be returned to the intake (like the XB does stock) Geez, I'm sure I forgot something but bottom line, grab the rules for your racing organization and read them carefully - ALSO find the BBS for the race org you're going to be racing with and you'll be SHOCKED at how friendly and helpful racers are for a "newbie" compared to sportbike riders. Racing is a totally different crowd! Brace yourself, the addiction is bad and incurable! | ||
| 07xb12r |
Hey 31, I race, but just the dragstrip so far. I know you will need full leathers, up to date dot helmet, Tray under your engine, all glass taped or removed, not sure of the if nuts/fasteners need to be safety tied. Good luck bro  P.S. Just be careful on the streets.....I heard tell them there "law enforcement officials" don't much care for us racing type Buellers. Just kidding there bud, I know it's "ruff" to say the least for you guys out there  | ||
| Slaughter |
The "cost" to start racing? Really, if you're talking the minimum to make the bike legal for racing, it hardly costs a thing except that bellypan and a roll of blue 3M masking tape and a couple days of safety wiring and drilling. Costs to get certified depend on your racing organization - there's always a new racer school - costs vary. They teach very little at New Racer School except procedures, flag signals, and they usually touch on some common sense things and then do some track familiarization but not much as far as "teaching racing." At least that is true with WSMC and CCS. Can't speak for the other organizations but generally, the new racer schools just want to make sure you're predictable and consistent (safe to pass for another racer) - and aren't worried about making you a faster rider/racer. The recurring costs are ONE set of tires each race weekend. Entry ees are on the order of $200-$350 depending on how many classes you want to race. Add to that wear and tear, 1 or 2 crashes a year and you really are looking at a fair chunk of change each month. The recurring costs are big, the purchase costs are nothing. Almost forgot the cost of medical insurance. A no compromise supplemental policy is about $900 a month or more but that gets you in to see ANY doctor, ANY specialist, ANY hospital. Do not neglect insurance! Look into your policy, you might be surprised to find that your insurance will not cover you in a sanctioned race. (Message edited by slaughter on August 13, 2007) | ||
| Coolice |
Welcome to the madness. There are a few threads here on Buell racers starting up. Check the archives or maybe someone will pull them up for you. Have fun!  And always ask, we are friendly here | ||
| Dtx |
What kind of longevity are you guys getting out of your track motors? I have had my 04 12R to 3 trackdays and the crank bearing has failed (among other things). Yup, that means total motor tear down and rebuild! Bike only has 13K on it and prior use was just street riding. Once I get this all fixed I may be a bit reluctant to put it back on the track and push it that hard. (Message edited by dtx on August 13, 2007) | ||
| Slaughter |
I hate to say that now we're getting into finer points of the racing motors. The shorter stroke XB9 (3 1/8 stroke) can tolerate the higher revs - bored to 3 13/16 bore - 1169cc - it can last longer when bouncing off the rev limiter a tad better than the XB12 (In my opinion) The problem with that engine mod is it's pretty pricey because you need pistons, cylinders and re-balancing. Now you're probably going to want cams, bigger valves, manganese bronze guides, springs, all starting to run the costs up. See where it can go? | ||
| Dtx |
Slaughter, You opinion seems in line with my thoughts I have been forming as of late. As it turns out when the crank bearing failed it caused the piston to start slapping which in turn scored the cylinders up pretty good (so my dealer says). I love taking my bike to the track and dicing it up with my friends, but if this is the risk I am taking (financially) to have fun then I will have to seriously think about whether using this bike/motor on the track is a good idea. Oh, the oil pump gear drive was badly worn too. For my rebuild, I am probably gonna need a new crank (or lightened one), new pistons and new cylinders. On the bright side, this could be a good opportunity to build up a little monster. My dealer is already indicating that this would be the time to upgrade the performance of the motor. Frankly, I am looking for longevity. | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
You could always race a Blast. Cheap fun and lasts awhile. When its top end time, just one cylinder! Was a riot last month watching a stock Blast and XBlast duke it out in a very close race! It would, of course, take convincing at least one friend to buy a Blast (or slow down).  | ||
| Diablobrian |
I didn't see any mention of a steering damper yet, most racing organizations require them as well as all the things Slaughter mentioned. Racing is highly addictive, but it is NOT cheap. Tires are the number one expense assuming you have all your gear and the bike paid for. I'd run the bike with a stock motor at first until your skills catch up to the bike's capabilities. Tire warmers are not a MUST, but they are highly recommended because it is really hard to wait for your tires to warm up while the competition is pushing harder in the corners and pulling away from you. The cost of repairs after having either the front or rear wash out on you is going to be close to what the cost of the warmers would be. Take extra: pegs (2 sets), brake pads: front, clutch and brake levers, and shift and brake pedals, and shift linkage as well as the hardware to install the parts, an extra handle bar, an extra pair of grips, duct tape, an extra belt if you still run one, and tools. These spares will keep you from having your weekend end early due to broken parts.. You will want at least a rear stand, or both stands if you run tire warmers. At first you should be able to get someone to share power with you in the pits, but you'll want a generator eventually to run the warmers, a radio so you can hear the calls to the grid, and a good strong fan for cooling down yourself and the bike. You'll also want a minimum 10'x10' e-z up canopy. there isn't much shade at most tracks. It isn't cheap to get started straight into racing, it is easier to accumulate the gear over a year or two of track days which is what most people do. You will also be surprised at how fast you will use up tires, and brakes. Depending on how many classes you enter you can go through two rear tires in a weekend, and a front of course and a set of front brake pads every other weekend if you really pushing it. | ||
| Diablobrian |
Oh yeah, I'd also recommend upgrading suspension on both ends before worrying about internal motor mods. You'll get a better return for your dollar that way IMHO. | ||
| Slaughter |
Brian is EXACTLY right about keeping the bike pretty stock-motored. Suspension and brakes and proper tires MUST come ahead of fooling with the motor! Turning, handling, braking confidence will do MUCH MORE to dropping lap times than HP will - we're not making that up. Besides, a Penske or Ohlins and re-worked forks do not affect reliability! I shoulda been paying more attention above. Suspension and handling BEFORE engine has been a crusade of mine for a long time. Brian's right on the money. | ||
| Diablobrian |
I also forgot that tire warmers can reduce the number of heat cycles your tires go through and that makes them last longer if you aren't burning the rubber off on the track too fast for it to matter (which is pretty common at first). It seems like a small thing until you've gone out to race and find that tires that have "gone off". Between the pre-race track day, practice sessions, and finally your races you'll be surprised how fast this happens. Ever wonder why tires that appear to have lots of tread are sold so cheap as race take-offs? It's because they have had too many heat cycles, and are (for racing purposes) hard as rocks. Sure they'll last a good bit on the street, but then again most street riders don't ride fast enough to know the difference. | ||
| Slaughter |
One thing to consider is that the CHEAPEST track day is the practice day for your racing organization. Generally the day's practice is on the order of $75 once you're race-licensed. I know a number of racers who ONLY ran Saturday practices until they felt comfortable enough to race. Not saying that's a GOOD idea but it can still get you some cheaper practice and seat time. NO instructors are available though during practicing. The other thing is that the mix of speeds is impressive. You can be zooming along at 90% and then get passed in the turn by somebody going 30-50MPH faster. Takes getting used to but it IS good practice. Also, during race practice, there are no minimum separation distances for passing so sometimes you can be nearly brushed if being passed by two riders at once. | ||
| Slaughter |
and like Eric said a few posts above, don't discount the Blast. We have a few racers at Willow who are running them just for the silliness of it. Tim Hurley spent LESS on tires in a YEAR of racing his Blast than I spent in a weekend on tires on the XB! | ||
| Firebolt428 |
I've been running the 1169cc kit in both my bikes and it is pricey. Had to take a year off this year in order to get caught back up after 3 years of running them. But the motor's do last and mine have lasted longer than some of my friends SV's and IL4's. Just make sure you find a good shop that knows how to build them and tune them properly. I ran my bike for a year stock so I would agree with the above posts. Get everything in order first then think about motor upgrades. | ||
| Halsracing |
Bradley just give me a call @ Halshd & Buell. I would be more than happy to spend time one on one with you. There are many opinions on how to start road racing, and with over 20 + years I have learned what is most important at the start. This invitation is for all. Ph# 1-800-966-4443 or 262-814-7282 and ask to be connected with Terry Galagan www.terry.galagan@halshd.com | ||
| Xb9 |
DTX, which crank bearing failed, just curious? | ||
| Dtx |
The one for the rear cylinder...? I think that's what the dealership said. Either way, supposedly there are updated parts for this area that are better then the 2004 ones. I read in Fuell last week that the 08's have even beefier ones, hence the new higher redline. After doing some searching on here it sounds like I am not the only one that this has ever happened to, especially in the 04 model year. | ||
| Halsracing |
Drake (DTX) I would think the bearing your talking about is the left side main. That bearing has being updated 4 times. But we have had no failures in any of our race engines since the first update. Give me a call with a part # and I can tell you if you have got a good bearing that you can race with NO FEAR. TG | ||
| Dtx |
Terry, Here is a partial list of parts for my rebuild. Is one of these the good bearing? 10080 drain hose clamp 1.00 11177A retaining ring 1.00 1.20 16466-04 cylinder w/piston & rings 1.00 17058-02D engine gasket kit 1.00 24215-04A flywheel w/ conn. rod 1.00 24331-36 bushing 2.00 24605-07 bearing roller 1.00 24647-87 gearshaft- blue bearing 1.00 25598-91 cam gear shaft bushing 4.00 26204-91A oil pump kit 1.00 26391-06 oil pump drive gear 1.00 26492-91 gerotor set, feed oil pu 1.00 26493-91 gerotor separator plate 1.00 8881 outer race bearing 1.00 | ||
| Halsracing |
DTX you have the best bearing that money can buy 24605-07 left main crank TG | ||
| Jim32092 |
Hal-do you recall any trouble with the 35118-03 or 35114-02 retaining rings staying in the grooves? If so is there a fix. I assume the 24605-07 is a drop in? can I get the bearing at Harley/Buell parts counter? | ||
| Jim32092 |
oops--I mean Terry, not Hal-sorry Terry | ||
| Dtx |
Thanks Halsracing! | ||
| Halsracing |
Jim those are retaining clips that hold the left crank seal and the left main bearing in place. No we have had 0 problems with those clips Thanks TG | ||
| Halsracing |
Sorry Jim forgot about that bearing. Yes it is a drop in,or I should say press in. And yes it is a HD/BUELL part. TG | ||
| Gearhead |
Greetings Terry, I hope you will answer this question as I've posted it in the Knowledge Vault and have been left hangin'. I'm racing an XB12R and have been told by several guys including Henry Duga that a nice upgrade is to install "9" pistons in a "12" to increase compression. Is it REALLY as simple as swapping out pistons? No head interference? How about fuel mapping? I'm using the over the counter race ecm not the programable one, so will I need to upgrade to the Henry Duga model to effectively benefit from this swap? Thanks in advance... ps - I've already done suspension upgrades. | ||
| Halsracing |
Ralph I would rather speak to you in person about this one. So just give me a call @ Hals HD & Buell 1-800-966-4443 or 262-814-7282 and ask for Terry in the speed shop. Thanks TG |
