| Author | Message | ||
     Cupcake_mike |
A battery that will take a charge at least... Put a new battery in, yuasa ytx14h about 3 weeks ago, as my old run didn't want to consistently hold a charge. On the way to work at 0 dark thirty this morning, I get off the interstate and as the bike drops below 2500rpms I lose my headlight, that was a bit scary as the stop sign at the bottom of the off ramp is around a corner and there was absolutely no moonlight. I found that if I rev the throttle to above 2500 my headlight comes back. I am not a buell electrical genius but does my assumption that my "new" battery shit the bed seem reasonable? Can't imagine there is much else going on, but please school me in case I am forgetting something. | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
I'd say your regulator/rectifier went on vacation down south. Sometimes it is worse and the stator goes bad. I'd check the R/R first though since it is a much easier fix. (Message edited by electraglider_1997 on September 02, 2016) | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
An awesome new battery doesn't do anything for you if it's not connected very firmly to the cables. That said, it's perfectly possible that your fancy new battery may have dumped excrement in its bed. I've had a couple batteries that crapped out in a month. It happens. | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
I looked at your profile and see you already changed to the Mosfet so it probably isn't that unless a wire came loose. Do the checks with a multimeter on the Mosfet to verify that it is charging your battery correctly. | ||
| Reepicheep |
It turns out to be a bit of a hairball to diagnose, as all the parts work together to work at all. The stator creates the power from the rotation of the engine. It can partially fail for a while, and generate soem power, but not enough. The voltage regulator keeps the voltage from exceeding a level that will destroy the battery over time. The battery smooths the voltage from the stator and voltage regulator (which is an up and down wave). It also stores enough power to restart the bike. So, unfortunately, what you saw, could be a partially failing stator, a failing battery, or a failing voltage regulator. The next step would be to start doing unit tests of each part in isolation. The stator is the easiest to test. Disconnect it, and check the resistance between the leads, and the resistance between each lead and ground, with the motor off. Then check the AC output of the stator with the motor running at a few different RPM's. The numbers you should see are listed in the service manual and on this board here and there. Also, take the derby or inspection cover off the primary, and take a whiff. A bad stator usually smells beyond horrible. Next easiest to test is probably the battery. Take it off, hook it to a $30 charger / reconditioner that will pay for itself in 3 years if you hook it to the bike when in garage, and recharge it. Then hook the battery to a heavy 12v load like an old headlight, and check the voltage. If it is not running the headlight, or drops below 11v or so, it is dead dead". Half dead is harder, but if you charge it first then take it to an auto parts store, they can probably load test for you. If those are fine, then it may be the voltage regulator, which is really hard to test. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Oh, and make sure the terminals are tight and clean first. That usually shows up as a starting problem, not a running problem, but it could be that also. | ||
| Cupcake_mike |
I have one of those R/Rs from roadster cycle for the last 20k, so hopefully that's not the problem. He said he has only had a few failures with thousands of them sold. I gotta imagine my stator is still good, as I said I am charging above 2k, which is expected. Battery cables are good, I checked these when I got to work, because it was easy and about all the time I had to do, troubleshooting wise. | ||
| Arry |
When you got to work, and shut it off, did you try to restart it? | ||
| Cupcake_mike |
Arry, I did not I am hoping my jumpstart pack will get me spinning so I can get home...the old lady really hates driving 60 miles to pick me up when my bikes break. | ||
| Arry |
Give it a try, without the jumpstart pack. The problem may be head light related, and your battery and charging system could be OK. | ||
| Froggy |
A stock headlight bulb won't shut off from low voltage, it will just look dim, but you would still have light. HID/LED/etc may or may not shut off depending on their design. | ||
| Cupcake_mike |
its an LED, which struck me as odd...if someone would have asked me a week ago, I would have assumed an LED would work at way lower voltage than the ignition would tolerate to keep the bike running. My particular LED must have some kind of protection where it shuts off when it gets to a particular low voltage. (Message edited by cupcake_mike on September 02, 2016) | ||
| Froggy |
The LEDs themselves likely not run at 12V, so there is some kind of circuitry/controller that translates the 12V to whatever the LEDs need, so at say 10V it doesn't have enough power to run the unit, and out it goes. Good news is that you don't have some weird electrical issue that is cutting off the light, just likely low voltage from a probable stator or battery or regulator issue. | ||
| Reepicheep |
The LED's are probably wired in series, so when the voltage drops below a fixed (pretty high) value, the D (diode) part of the LED is a switch that turns off. Picture it like a little snake river canyon, and the electrons are like little evil kneival. When they are going slow, they stop at the ramp because they know they won't make it. If they are going fast enough, they will jump the canyon and continue to the other side. You can use a switching converter to change any voltage to any other voltage (with a proportional change in current, no free lunch), but I bet most LED's just stack the elements in series and add a little series regulator (probably just a resistor) to dial in the voltage. So most LED headlight assemblies likely would go dark long before a filament bulb would. | ||
| Cupcake_mike |
Made home from work last night and hooked up my ecm cable...9.2vdc@idle, 10.5vdc@3k  Any charging system failures i have ever had were all or nothing as far as output goes, so i guess either something new is happening to me or that r/r isn't allowing enough voltage to pass? I had a 15 hr day yesterday, which included a rapid unplanned plant shutdown, so i didn't feel like testing stator output or r/r troubleshooting...that will happen on my next day off (whenever that will be). | ||
| Reepicheep |
Bummer. Sorry to hear that Mike. Disconnect the stator, and measure that alone. That will eliminate at least one unknown. | ||
| Cupcake_mike |
Did the stator test and was getting 15 VAC between each phase, which is on the lower end of the spec...r/r testing looked ok. Both batteries i have passed the load test I installed a lcd voltmeter in the dash to keep an eye on things...at low engine speed it hovers around 12.2-12.3 but at cruising speed i am getting 12.5-12.7...only went for about a ten mile ride so time will tell. I drained the primary and the fluid didn't smell great, but not near as bad as it did when the stator went out on my m2. So, basically, it looks like my stator is probably on the way out, but i will keep an eye on it...thinking that taking all the connectors apart, cleaning and packing with dielectric may have helped me some. | ||
| Froggy |
You should be doing at least 14 volts while cruising. At 12.7 it isn't charging, it is just maintaining. My X1 is doing the exact same thing, I've just been riding around without the lights connected and I will get the stator fixed over the winter. | ||
| Ourdee |
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| Reepicheep |
Yeah, 12.7V at speed is a really bad sign. Could be stator, could be VR, but could be bad grounds or battery terminals. | ||
| Cupcake_mike |
Well, turns out it was the stator...replaced it about a week and a half ago with a CE 6014, have put 1000 miles on the uly since with no problems...putting out 14.1-14.3 at speed depending on ambient temp. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Thanks for posting the followup, that could be helpful for the next person. Looks like about $100 for the CE 6014. I wonder if they have a source for them that isn't HD? | ||
| Cupcake_mike |
Reep, Not sure what you mean, the cycle electric is not HD and that is specifically why I purchased it (can't make myself buy a "new" part that I have to modify before I can even make it work.) The wires are potted right to the stator with no need for the plastic guard that the stock one has. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Brilliant, thanks Mike! I was googling your comment about the CE 6014 and came across a post on another site that implied they were selling HD parts and ran out of time to dig deeper, so I posted that note and moved on. Digging deeper, it looks like it is their own, it's very well made, and fairly priced. Awesome! Off to the knowledge vault to update the alternate parts source lists. | ||
| Reepicheep |
http://www.badweatherbikers.com/cgibin/discus/show .cgi?tpc=3842&post=2563208#POST2563208 Please feel free to include any summary information on that thread you feel is useful. Thanks for taking the trouble to post what you learned! |
