| Author | Message | ||
     Hoover_uly |
On a ride last weekend, I filled up at an off brand gas station (fuel light on) and immediately noticed the engine was not running properly. Died at idle a few times and I had to work to keep it running. I assumed I got some poor quality fuel or they had regular in their premium tank. I almost cut the ride short but it was a cool day and the engine started running better so I took the long way home. I needed to run the fuel out anyway. No drama and I finished the ride. On a ride today, it started and ran OK but after about 10 miles on the freeway, I took an exit and stopped. Taking off from the stop, the engine started making a hell of a racket, clattering loudly for a few seconds. It may have been 10 degrees warmer today. I stopped about 2 blocks further and filled up at a name brand station. Performance improved immediately and no more racket. I added about 2.5 gallons of premium. This is probably just paranoia but a little later in the ride, the engine seemed to be vibrating more than usual cruising at 3,000 to 3,500 RPM where it typically runs fairly smoothly. Otherwise, performance seems normal. I seems unlikely I did any serious damage but other than adding more premium fuel as soon as possible, is there anything I need to check or be aware of? | ||
| Etennuly |
Most frequently the problem with bad gas is water. When you get a dose of water it can take a tank or two to get it all worked out. I toss in a shot of Seafoam fuel additive to help clear it out. It would be good to pull and inspect the spark plugs. That can lay to rest problems that bad fuel can do. And a rough running period can foul the plugs. Bad octane problems can cause detonation that can kill plugs also. If the plugs are good put them back in and run'em. | ||
| Nillaice |
Yeah, an ounce or 2 of sea foam or chemtool should resove your remaining 'bad gas'  | ||
| Arcticktm |
If you suspect the gas, you need to get as much of it out of the tank as possible and replace with something you trust. I doubt it is as simple as "non-premium" instead of premium. A difference in octane alone should not cause idle issues, but woudl present as a pinging under hard load/high heat most likely. Actually, higher octane fuel is more resistant to ignition, so can actually make some idle problems worse (as evidenced by the tech letter I received from my friends at GM about my 1992 Pontiac - they told me I was causing the problem by using premium fuel where not required!). My money is on water in gas, like Etennuly wrote, if your problem is in fact the gas. | ||
| Hoover_uly |
Thanks for all the responses. I have a can of Sea Foam so I'll get some in the tank tonight and run it for a bit then check the plugs. Supposed to be good weather this weekend so maybe I can run another tank out. I do suspect fuel since it died in the parking lot of the station but I understand that could be a coincidence.... Steve | ||
| Ourdee |
Side note: How much regular is left in a hose when you buy premium out of a single nozzle pump? | ||
| Fotoguzzi |
a thimble full? | ||
| Ourdee |
I don't know.  | ||
| Ourdee |
http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB122944043385810527 | ||
| Con_brio |
About 30 years ago when I was younger and foolish (now I'm older and foolish) I ran my GT550 out of gas 2 miles from home at 3:00 a.m. I pushed it a block to a closed gas station. I emptied each of 6 hoses into a pop(soda) can that I cut open and got enough to get home! Probably 5-6 ounces. | ||
| Arry |
Ourdee, That link gives an answer that pretty much matches my suspicions (about 1/3 gallon typical). So, we do get screwed, especially when just topping up (you're not sure how far to the next gas). Sometimes, if I'm just topping up (a gallon or so), I'll just get Regular, because about 1/3 will be Regular even if I'm paying for Premium. | ||
| Ourdee |
I used to pull in behind my wife when she was burning premium in the cage. My other alternative is too simple. I come home from work. Strap a one gallon can on the rack. Head to the gas station and get 1/2 a gallon for the mower or to dump into the cage. Then put the good stuff in Lil Red. I want to put a 3 gallon aluminum barrel aux. tank on the rear rack. | ||
| Etennuly |
Just so you know the plugs can be intimidating at first, well the back one anyways. I use a foot long extension with a wiggle end. Use some never seize on the threads and start the plugs back in several turns by hand. You can use a length of vacuum or fuel hose to start the rear one.  | ||
| Arcticktm |
Probably chiming in too late, but if you really think its bad fuel, don't just add more. You need to drain/siphon out as much as possible. Just the octane (non premium vs. premium) is unlikely to cause the problems you describe. Low octane should just cause pinging under load/heat conditions. Low octane fuel can actually be better at idle or for cold starting based on my experience with '90's GM V6's! I'm with Vern on the water in gas. Getting it out of there is still way better than trying to run it through with gas treatment though (sea foam, dry gas/ethanol or other). | ||
| Hoover_uly |
I've had the plugs out and they looked fine. Cleaned them up a bit and reinstalled with a little anti seize. Used the rubber hose trick. Put a bit of sea foam in the tank and it seemed to run fine around the neighborhood. Will take it out for a run this weekend. No argument here on water in the fuel. After the drive, if she still does not seem happy, I may drain the remaining fuel as recommended. Thanks again. | ||
| Mark_weiss |
There are a couple of things that can help if you have water in your fuel and don't want to drain the tank. Ethanol does a good job of mixing with water and carrying it through the fuel system. Filling up with oxygenated fuel can help. Adding an appropriate amount of fuel system cleaner (containing ethanol) may help as well. If you actually have 'bad gas' the bike should run poorly, constantly. Poor fuel is just bad and does not allow for better and worse operation. A common fuel 'contaminant' is actually diesel. Low octane will will yield smooth running under most conditions. Pinging/detonation will occur when under extra load (acceleration). Under steady state conditions, even 85 octane will be OK, just cruise easy. 85 octane fuel will not cause rough running, just pinging under extra load. | ||
| Mark_weiss |
1/3 of a gallon is about 43 ounces. That's three and a half cans of your favorite beverage. That would be an awful lot of leftover fuel. When I worked in a gas station, we would only get about 6 ozs of fuel from the hose when we'd remove them to change the filter. | ||
| Sagehawk |
I use a amsoil product in bikes fuel that works for water control. My mazda b2500 who just turned 250000 miles, I use startron. That seems to take care of wet fuel problems . Ever 4th oil change, I use amsoil pi to help keep fuel and top end clean. I can't remember last time I had purchased bad gas. That's interesting fact on the 1/3 gallon in filter n lines at the pump. | ||
| Ourdee |
Mark, How much did the filter hold? | ||
| Mark_weiss |
Never checked it separately, when we would drain the hose, the filter emptied too. Maybe a few ounces. Even if modern fuel pumps can double the volume in the hose assembly, that's still not much. | ||
| Mark_weiss |
It could probably be checked with a modern pump. Take an extra container and after filling up and shutting the pump off (need to check with a pump that has a lever switch), squeeze the handle again and see how much fuel empties into container number two. |
