| Author | Message | ||
     Electraglider_1997 |
The Prius oil filter is the same size as the Buell filter and screws right on. Prius has a 1.5 liter engine. Prius filter is actually less expensive than the Buell filter. I am not using it but probably could. Looks like a better filter. | ||
| Itileman |
Why would I want to filter my electrical current?  | ||
| Ronmold |
You can use it but your engine will shut off at stoplights!  | ||
| Crusty |
Go to your local NAPA and get a NAPA #1394 filter. it costs $2.87 after tax. It's NAPAs own brand, but it's a Wix filter. It'll work at least as good as the Buell filter, and possibly better. | ||
| Uly_dude |
Hey Crusty, I just went to NAPA yesterday and ended up paying $7.50+ for that same filter. What gives? I thought it would be cheaper there to..... | ||
| Brakes2late |
Get the Bosch filter at Autozone. A little over 5 bucks when it's on sale. | ||
| Dfishman |
My Suzuki 140 horsepower outboard motor uses the same filter as my Uly.I use #1394 from Napa. | ||
| Nobuell |
The NAPA and Wix filters have the correct low pressure relief valve required for the low pressure lubrication system on the Buell. Just because it will fit, does not mean it will work correctly. I would not use any filter that does not publish the relief valve ratings to be sure it is correct for the bike. I buy WIX filters at the local auto parts store for about $6.00 each. It is not worth it to me to save a couple of bucks on some unknown filter brand. The NAPA and WIX filters are very good quality. | ||
| Crusty |
Ulydude; I just bought four 21394 filters for the Buells and three 21348 filters for my Norge from my local NAPA dealer and they charged me $2.702 each. List is supposed to be $3.250/each. I have the receipt in front of me. If your dealer charged you $7.50, then either it's a different filter, or you got hosed. (Message edited by Crusty on June 14, 2010) | ||
| Motoskier |
My local Harley dealers sell me the OEM filters for $7 ea. I see people selling (trying) them on Ebay for $10 or more plus shipping. I don't get it! | ||
| Reepicheep |
I have a hard time imagining a scenario where a low pressure versus high pressure relief valve would save a motor. I'm guessing the filter would have to be "half blocked" or more before even the low pressure relief valve does anything... and if there is enough garbage in the oil system to half plug my oil filter, I'm not sure if I would rather have the oil pressure just drop (blocked filter with no bypass yet) or have the oil filter bypass (meaning all that garbage that half plugged the filter is now circulating). Where is the oil pressure sensor? Downstream of the filter? If that is the case, I am probably better off with the higher bypass pressure. I'd rather see an oil light and go into "stop that motor now" mode then have the filter just start bypassing without any kind of indication. Either way, I'm guessing that if you are in a state where the bypass matters, you already killed your motor, you just don't know it yet. | ||
| Mikef5000 |
My local Harley dealers sell me the OEM filters for $7 ea. I see people selling (trying) them on Ebay for $10 or more plus shipping. I don't get it! Lot's of people aren't close to a dealership. | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
The relief valve setting on a K&N branded Prius oil filter is from 8 psi to 11 psi and has a built in nut for removing it. They are made by Champion Labs which also makes Mobil 1 oil filters. 8 to 11 psi is recommended for our ULYs elsewhere on BadWeb as correct relief valve setting also referred to as Bypass Valve. The Fram has a 14 psi setting which would be too high. Fram has many critics. Info on oil filters and their design: http://www.knizefamily.net/minimopar/oilfilters/in dex.html http://www.calsci.com/motorcycleinfo/FilterStudy.h tml | ||
| Buellridersww |
What is the number for Mobil 1 oil filter? | ||
| Nobuell |
Cold oil can cause a bypass condition as well as a dirty filter. Seems crazy to me to try to save a couple bucks on an unproven filter application. I have run the M1 filter on my cars a few times. They are decent filters. I have not been able to get published specifications on the filter from the manufacturer. Just because it is made by Champion, does not mean it is the same. I will not use a filter that does not have manufacturer published data. It is not worth the risk to me. | ||
| Yamafreak |
I run a Super Teck ST4967 oil filter from Wal Mart What do we know about these filters? | ||
| Reepicheep |
At some point Super Tech filters were Champion Labs filters, which where by all accounts good filters. NoBuell... on startup, oil pressure is high, but is it really high enough across just the filter element to trip the bypass valve? Pressure through the whole system would be high, but most of that pressure would never see the filter. I have no factual information on the matter, I'm just speculating. It would be an interesting test to run, somebody call mythbusters!  | ||
| Reepicheep |
And perhaps more importantly, is the "highest" bypass pressure of all the filters that will physically fit at all a problem for the Buell motor? Given the design of the pump, I think it's going to move X volume of oil with every rotation, or basically die trying. I have an XB9 with 30k miles of non HD filters, and the pump was perfect, and the (old style flawed design) pinion gear was still maybe 60%. I'm thinking if I want my pump working harder or my filter bypassing, and I'm thinking I want my pump working harder. Especially on motors that have the new style copper beryllium pinion gear. | ||
| Nobuell |
Reepicheep, I may be wrong, but I think I did read somewhere that the main reason is bypass during cold startup. This could mean cold ambient as well as motor temperatures. This may or may not be as much of an issue in a rolling element motor versus a plain bearing motor that depends on high oil pressure to function properly. It is very hard to get good accurate information regarding oil filter performance. That is why I stick with a known commodity such as a WIX or other good brand that has a rating for the specific application. Many of the name brand companies do not list motorcycle filters in their catalogs. The nice thing about WIX is that they have promptly responded to questions I have emailed regarding applications and they provide a lot of data on their website regarding each filter. One thing for sure, talking about oil filters is just about as volatile as an oil discussion! | ||
| Reepicheep |
Agreed NoBuell... I wasn't trying to start a fight, just hunting facts. I started reading this thread with the position "mass produced oil filters of just about any recognizable brand are all functionally similar, particularly for short change intervals, and will all work fine". So when buying one, I just find one (for Prius or Tercel), pull it out of the box, make sure it looks mechanically solid and well made, and if so buy it and run it. My main concern was that there was enough filter material, and that the case and seal will be mechanically sound. Then I saw your point about the bypass pressure, which seemed valid. Then I did a little google searching and saw a lot of ambiguity... lots of people that seem to have a lot of expertise saying "it will only bypass if something has gone terribly wrong" and other credible posts saying "every cold start". Then I thought a little further, and got to the point where I was wondering if a 7 psi bypass versus a 50 psi bypass really matters... in 30k miles on an XB9SX with lots of filters (mainly Super Tech, but a few Pure One's, and even a couple of Fram Heavy Duty's) I never had a filter bulge, an oil pump blow up, or a line or gasket leak. So I decide I was just confused, and figured I'd ask. It would be fun to set up a rig and test it with an old filter and old oil... (Message edited by reepicheep on June 15, 2010) | ||
| Nobuell |
Reepicheep I did not take it as a start to a fight. Same as you, just a discussion. I enjoy hearing and discussing others opinions. | ||
| Jespo_m2 |
I'm currently running a FRAM on my 06 Uly. I've puyt a few hundred miles it... should I replace it ASAP? | ||
| Reepicheep |
I wouldn't. I ran several on my other XB and it is at 30k miles with no problems at all. Here is where I think we stand with hypothesis... all credible, none very definitive: View 1) The factory part has a low bypass pressure, and there was a specific known reason for this, so aftermarket filters should be selected that have a similar low bypass pressure. View 2) The bypass pressure for the factory filter is not important, and is probably not even accurate anyway. No matter what, the pump will pump X amount with every rotation. The pressure they specify was simply the pressure the filter manufacturer they chose happened to implement. It makes no difference, provided you don't explode the filter or blow out gaskets when the bike turns over (which no-one has ever managed to do with any filter). View 3) Nobody thinks the factory filter bypass pressure matters (including the factory), but the factory does (wisely) pick standard configurations and test them to death, so you shouldn't even change the things you don't think matter, as you are then the beta tester. So (and I am just making this up) people running higher bypass oil filters are loading up the oil pump pinion gear at start up to a force beyond it's design spec, and causing it to wear, while people using stock pumps just kick them into bypass mode and the pinion gear does not wear. I think I am still in camp 2... But it's fun to analyze, and would be even funner to test. Like I did say, the one data point I have is an XB with 30k miles of non factory filters, and not a hint of problem anywhere with leaks or oiling problems. | ||
| Nobuell |
I think one of the over riding factors regarding the various camps would be most Buell enthusiasts are more than likely near fanatical about changing oil often and most will use decent oil. Accelerated engine wear due to oil filter type is probably either non existent or to low to evaluate. But, speculative engineering is a great past time when not riding. | ||
| Griffmeister |
Just for the hell of it and to throw another idea into the mix is what about direction of flow? I suppose if I read the oil filter FAQ's I probably would have seen something about this but where's the fun in that? I know it makes a difference in fuel systems. | ||
| Ronmold |
I was told by a fairly credible person that wally world Super Tech filters were made by Hastings filters and although low-cost, as good or better than anything on their shelf. The higher the price for filters probably means more cost for advertising rather than more quality products. | ||
| Yamafreak |
Ronmold That is good to know!  | ||
| Uly_dude |
Hey Crusty, I believe I got hosed then. It was the 1394 filter from the Napa store. Next time I go down there I'm going to ask questions before I purchase anything there. | ||
| Ronmold |
Greg, that seems to be a habit with you lately, QUIT IT!  | ||
| Uly_dude |
OK, so where do you get your filters from Ron? And do you pay less than $5? BTW, I've never set foot in a Walmart yet. It's my one claim to fame.... | ||
| Ronmold |
Wix 51394 from Amsoil, 8.35 list | ||
| Santafe |
I've been buying my filters from American Sportbike. Price is $6.95. They also have the gaskets in handy packages reasonably priced. Amsoil Preferred Customer price is $6.35 and they're the same as the Wix at NAPA. NAPA for $3 is a bargain and there's no shipping. That's where I'll be buying mine from now on. I just checked the Amsoil site and they have the 20W50 MC synthetic oil I usually buy priced at $24/Qt!! If that isn't a mistake, it's the last time I buy their oil even though it's the best. | ||
| Luftkoph |
buells and hd are roller bearing cranks are they not? So the most likely have a high volume low pressure lube system vs.a high pressure system for plain bearing bottom ends. Ive always understood that the pressure bypass was for clogged filter,like might happen if you never change your oil or filter in 10 years. On bob is the oil guy I think the super tech was on of the best filters you could buy. | ||
| Oldfartnbuell |
uly dude smart man!! walmart is NOT good for america! Tonto |
