| Author | Message | ||
     Snojet |
Okay Badwebbers I need your help. Sorry for the long read.... I reported this same problem months ago. What the bike is doing is; at normal operating temperature the engine will stumble/bog down at moderate to heavy throttle movement or above approx 3,300 rpm. Since I commute 60 miles round trip, mostly on the highway this is a problem. When the bike is first starting (about 1 mile to 10 miles) out it runs real good (normal). But as the commute continues the problem occurs. This is what I had months ago and after several attempts to fix (will explain later) I still have the problem. Also, before the last set of replacement of different parts the bike would trip the red light and really run badly. Now listen up, this really puts a twist in the problem. After about 20 miles on the highway I pull off on the "off-ramp" to my exit. At the stop light I am able to turn off the bike and let the cooling fan perform it's duties. Or sometimes, I've pulled off to the side of the road and turn off the bike and let the cooling fan perform it's job and start out again. In the past warmer weather the fan would run normally, now in the winter the fan hardly comes on. I would then start the bike up again and go up the main thorough-fair (or back on the highway), speed limit is 50mph or 55mph. I can get upto 60mph upto 75mph and maintain. After this "reset" the bike will run normally. Then after a couple of miles it's back to running with that nasty stumble/ bog. Bike has a little over 12,000 miles on it. No mods at all. Run 91 or better octane gas. 2006 XB12X. FYI - for what it might be worth... Way-way before this problem occurred I did mess around with the fuel maps. I was trying to get that "Square Idle" thing dialed in. I didn't have much luck, I put the maps like I found them. I did to a "burn/flash" approx 6 times. Bike ran great for month after this trial/event. Okay, here is what I've done.... With ECMspy I found some code(s) directing me to the O2 sensor. No other codes listed. Cleared codes. Replaced both spark plugs and wires. Plugs indicated they were running lean. (It was time for a normal tune-up) The coil did ohm out ok, it was on the high side of the book limits. Replaced the O2 sensor. Checked wiring at/around ECM - found no defects. Reset the TPS and AFV. After this work the bike still has the problem. Next... ECMspy now shows O2 sensor again. No other codes listed. Cleared codes. Checked timing for grins. It's fine. Replaced air cleaner. - Just because (part of tune up). Replaced Air Intake Sensor. It's the sensor in the airbox that is located between the two head breather hoses. Yes, hoses are at the correct height. (At work and I can't remember the exact terminology) Replaced Head Temp Sensor. (The wait time for this part really is unacceptable!!!!!!) That's another story. Reset the AFV. Checked the port that is located just off of the the throttle body. It is plugged, as it should be. Results... At first test ride, (about 20 miles) I thought I fixed the problem, bike ran great. No codes in ECMspy. Then.... Back at commuting to work and home the problem has returned, but it is not as pronounced. And if I stop and perform the "reset" the bike runs great for the short time and then the problem returned. No codes in ECMspy. I thought I might have a bad fuel pump. But I can't believe that because I can "reset" the bike and it run good for that short time. I don't think it is an intake seal problem. Again because of that "reset" thing. I am thinking that my ECM has a problem. That seem feasible with the "reset" thing. Alright Badwebbers, what do you think?? Also, posted this on the "Knowledge Vault - Troubleshooting forum". Thanks for any input/help! Regards, ..snojet.. | ||
| Fordrox |
Seems to me your Uly does'nt want you to go to work.  Sorry but other than a smart ass comment, I am no help. | ||
| Etennuly |
Sounds like a lot of the things I have been through. I'm thinking revisit the possible intake leak, I am going to do this on my '06 next time it acts up. The "V" shaped intake sets between two cylinders. These things all expand and move about as they heat up. When you reach optimum temperature you have failure, you stop, let it cool a bit, it runs OK until it again reaches that temperature(sooner than from cold start), and fail again. Almost would require riding with the airbox off to give a shot of something at the intake seals when the problem happens to see if that is when they would be sucking air. I don't know what would be a good product to shoot at it while riding that would give a proper indication without causing a hazardous condition like, oh.....fire or explosion, or wrecking from lack of attention or the engine revving all of the sudden. Perhaps pull over when it is running stupid and do it then? | ||
| Ddaleuly |
Got the O2 sensor code myself, found the wire from the sensor had rubbed the insulation where it went over the head/up into it's attachment. Rerouted the wire after wrapping w/electrical tape - fixed the problem. Yours could be the same as the insulation works until at operating temp. | ||
| Scooter808484 |
Intake seals would seem to be a more likely suspect if the problem was a constant throttle, air getting past the throttle and running lean. Sounds like this problem occurs more when making large throttle open moves, if I understand correctly. A that point there's little differentail pressure across the intake seals and they won't leak much air. A couple of codes on O2 sensor sure seems to be pointing the right direction. I'd have a good look at that thing and replace it if necessary. | ||
| Garrcano |
Check also the insulation of the Engine Temperature Sensor, mine was rubbing with the wire of the O2-sensor. In my case the problem continued till I changed the ETS. | ||
| Etennuly |
He already replaced the o2 sensor and the ETS. My bike does a similar thing at 70 mph under steady load up hill, I get a flashing red light and run-skip. Sometimes it is a solid red light. Shows an o2 code also. Stopping for a few minutes "resets" it for a few miles. It will seem to be bogging when in run-skip mode, because it fires every-other time to force cooling of the engine. My thinking is that the o2 code can be sent due to lean running and hot running. I have done all of the stuff he has done and more, but I have not done the intake seals. It is difficult to test for an intake leak because of the speed required to make it happen. I have replaced the ECM. It did make a difference, but it still has the problem showing up with less frequency. Cold weather makes the problem non existent. The comfort kit helped a lot, but the problem persists. For me intake seals are next. | ||
| Snojet |
Fordrox - Thanks for the laugh. Etennuly - So you've replaced your ECM and still have the problem. Well that blows-chunks! Like I've said before, I was leaning towards that. I do like your reasoning with the needed replacement of the intake seals. I really don't want to do that replacement but it might be where I go next. Ddaleuly - I've replaced the O2 sensor and carefully routed/tie-wrapped the wire harness and it still has the problem. Scooter808484 - Like Etennuly and now you have mentioned, the intake seals are suspect. Garrcano - I've replaced the ETS and carefully routed the wire harness. I want to thank every one mentioned here. I will still evaluate the possible solutions and then report back with the work that will be accomplished (hopefully I can fix this). I have even entertained the thought of sending it into the dealer and letting then charge me big money. Now I've just depressed myself even more. ..snojet.. | ||
| Ratbuell |
Intake seals are easy to test. Get the bike to the temp where it acts up. Go to the left side. Point some brake cleaner / carb cleaner at the spot where the intake meets the head, one at a time. Spray. If the engine stumbles when you spray...bad seal. I know. Tough area to get to. Get the cleaner with the little red straw, you can aim them pretty well that way. Might be easier if you pull the scoop off, but I'm pretty sure you can get to it without doing all that. 'course...I'm so used to tubers with a carb hanging off the RH side (and have yet to break my Uly). You might be able to do it from the right side as well, since the XB has a downdraft intake. Duh. Where'd I put my beer....?  | ||
| Etennuly |
The problem I have with that spray test is my bike has the issue at 70 mph and up. When slowing down, it goes away. Spraying things at that speed with the top of the air box off has got to be unsafe. It seems like the wind at that speed would cause a lot of turbulence in the area that would blow said carb cleaner back into your face. Further, having the air box cover and base off from it may allow for less heat retention and more air flow around the heads. That in itself could correct the problem. But damn..... if that were the fix, riding the Uly would feel like riding the old snow-mobiles of the '70's with the carburetor snorkel sucking at your belly! And that engine heat would be venting right in the frontal body parts. I have been working on this issue for almost three years. Everything I've done makes some faction of it change, almost always a little better, but no actual fix thus far. The dealer tried twice while under warranty, no fix, they just had the bike a week longer each time. They would not ride it the way it takes to make the problem happen. It has to go at least twenty miles, then go up a long grade at 70+ mph. It is getting worse each summer, that is pointing me towards the possible degrading of the intake seals. We shall see. Thank goodness I get a reprieve for about six months of winter each year. It just does not do it when the temperatures are below 70F regardless of speed or load. | ||
| Ratbuell |
If yours does it at cruise speed Vern, take off your TPS and hook it to a voltmeter. If you find your 2 signal pins (should have 3 - 12v, ground, signal; use hot and signal) connect your VOM to them, set for ohms. Use a screwdriver to sweep the TPS through throttle range. You should have a nice, even, clean sweep. Any dropouts or dead spots...there's your problem. If you have an oooolllllddddd VOM with a needle display, this is a great use for it. Easier to see minute dropouts with a needle compared to LCD. Sounds to me like you have a flat spot on your TPS. Not unusual, especially if you typically cruise at the same throttle position all the time. I know. Too little too late, there wasn't one in the box we just sent ya...lol | ||
| Etennuly |
Thanks, I will try that when I am in there next. It did take a good and proper TPS reset with no problems at all. Runs great in all other respects. | ||
| Ratbuell |
ah, but Vern...you do a TPS reset at closed position, not cruise position. Ever have a stereo with a 'crackle' at a certain volume level as you turned the knob? Same idea. All a TPS is, is a volume knob telling the ECM where you have the throttle. But....these go to eleven.... |
